How Far Does Free Speech in the US Go? Supreme Court Says it Trumps All
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How Far Does Free Speech in the US Go? Supreme Court Says it Trumps All

Washington : DC : USA | Mar 03, 2011 at 5:11 AM PST
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The Supreme Court of the United States (SCOTUS) upheld first amendment rights on Free Speech in its 8-1 decision in favour of the Wesborough Church protestors. The church had been protesting at funerals of soldiers and others, contributing their deaths to divine punishment of America's tolerance of gays.

In an almost unamimous decsion, including all of the most Liberal judges of SCOTUS, Chief Justice Roberts wrote, that Westboro Baptist Church's picketing at fallen soldiers' funerals "is certainly hurtful and its contribution to public discourse may be negligible." But he said the reaction may not be "punishing the speaker."

"As a nation we have chosen a different course - to protect even hurtful speech on public issues to ensure that we do not stifle public debate," Roberts said.

In the only deseceding opinion Justice Samuel A. Alito, Jr, considered to be conservative, wrote:

"Our profound national commitment to free and open debate is not a license for the vicious verbal assault that occurred in this case," he wrote.

As a Canadian I find the judgment of SCOTUS troubling. Where does the First Amendment end and where does hate speech start. One must sympathize with Justice Alito and his comment that the First Amendment should not b a license for the vicious verbal assault that occurred in this case.

While I realize that the First Amendment is sacred to Americans, a line should be drawn to hateful comments. In a discussion yesterday a legal expert tried to point out the difference.

In this case, apparently, whether the comments are personal or a public display make a difference. Had the Westborough Church followed the Snyder family home and harassed them, the outcome would have been different. Also SCOTUS did not take the internet attacks into consideration, although Justice Altino did.

As a Canadian, I will refrain from understanding America's First Amendment Right and gun laws. To say the least, both of them are troubling.

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Karl Gotthardt is based in Edmonton, Alberta, Canada, and is an Anchor for Allvoices.
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Posted By DavaCastillo Dava Castillo | about 1 year ago
Thanks for the report Karl.

Although I decry the actions of these despicable people, I agree with the Supreme Court Decision. We can't start eroding the first Amendment because it could cause serious repurcussions in future cases for which this could be a precedent. I would rather protect the right to assemble.

Having said this, I think we can expand the definition of hate crimes to include vicious attacks by a group. Hate crimes do include crimes against an individual for sexual orientation, but not against the type of public group display this church is using. Homophobia is the core of their demonstrations, i.e. a funeral event, which to me is as deliterious and objectionable as an attack on an individual.
Reply By firesisle Hardy Wright | about 1 year ago
Heya Dava,
On this, you and I agree completely. I detest Fred Phelps and everything he stands for, but the right of a citizen(even a scumbag like Phelps) must be upheld.
Reply By albertacowpoke Karl Gotthardt | about 1 year ago
I have no problem with your first amendment, but I think sometimes its interpretation is carried too far. I feel the same about your right to bear arms. I really think the line needs to be drawn somewhere. I fully support Canada's hate speech laws and any such hate speech has to be proven against our Charter of Rights and Freedoms.

Perhaps expanding your hate laws could speak to this issue.
Reply By firesisle Hardy Wright | about 1 year ago
Karl,
The problem with drawing a line is that it's really impossible; you've either got a right, or you don't. Our speech is free, or it isn't. Our whole system of government and the way we, as citizens interact with it, and with each other depends on it.

Once you begin drawing lines, you create slippery slopes, which are far worse.

One right which we don't have is the right to not be offended.
Reply By albertacowpoke Karl Gotthardt | about 1 year ago
We have drawn a line in Canada, and rightfully so. There is a limit to where free speech ends and where hate speech starts. I personally think we have it right in Canada. The Charter of Right guarantees free speech and each hatred allegation is measured against that and our hate speech laws.

I understand where you're coming from and if that is the American way, so be it.
Posted By mrspleats mrspleats | about 1 year ago
Mr rational thinking canadian and man of the world wow I say what a great post. I was thinking when I heard this that I am sure that this was not the thinking of the Founding Fathers who I am sure are rolling over in their graves to see the vitriol and misinterpretation and licence for hate associated with such a great right that people are intended or were intended to have.

Seems the liberals as well as the conservative are the same in not growing a spine and are willing to continue to hide as with hateful people under their first amendment right.

What a sad state of affair.

You said it well in these word "As a Canadian I find the judgment of SCOTUS troubling. Where does the First Amendment end and where does hate speech start. One must sympathize with Justice Alito and his comment that the First Amendment should not b a license for the vicious verbal assault that occurred in this case. "

Rated way way up brilliant mind!!

Have a fabulous day!
Reply By firesisle Hardy Wright | about 1 year ago
This is exactly what the Founding Fathers had in mind, because the process works. Hate speech is acceptable in the United States, because we feel it better to be out in the open than hidden behind closed doors. When exposed to the light of day, it can be shown for the empty rhetoric it truly is.

That's why the Supreme Court ruled in favor of the American Nazi Party when they wanted to march through Skokie, IL, home to many holocaust survivors (they won the right, but never made the march).

We, as Americans, have the right to assemble and speak out about any subject we wish; this is as blessing, because it means the we are very difficult to silence, and can't be silenced by our government, or peers.
Reply By albertacowpoke Karl Gotthardt | about 1 year ago
I accept your explanation Hardy. We have all those rights in Canada as well, but we have the ability to prosecute someone for hate speech. It's not like you can shut a Canadian up lol.
Reply By albertacowpoke Karl Gotthardt | about 1 year ago
Thanks for commenting Mrs.Pleats. I found the decision by the SCOTUS 8-1 by both Liberal and Conservative Justice's amazing. It would seem that Justice Alito is a voice hidden in the forest.
Posted By WendyCase WendyCase | about 1 year ago
I really think that this court is going to have a lot of blood on it's hands. A group from this so called church, which acts like a cult to me, protested at the funeral of one of my local fallen. He was not gay, nor should it matter. He voluntarily put his life on the line to serve his country and stand for our freedom; even "Those kind of people".

With security on hand, they were ALLOWED to cause more pain to a family who is suffering the loss of their brave son! Disgraceful, disgusting and that is NO CHRISTIAN.

I was raised in went to a baptist church, however, now I am embarrassed and seriously question the faith. I am seriously thinking about getting a group of tyrants together and be sure to crash every funeral of their family members and disrupt their so called church services on a regular basis. Maybe then they will get the picture, if you have a problem with the choice of the government take it to the hill, not to a ceremony where families are saying their final goodbyes.

I takes a cold hearted devil spawn to take away an innocent family's privacy to lay their loved one to rest.

Currently I have my cousin in action right now and his wife just made it home safely last month. Come home safely Douglas J. Case.
Reply By firesisle Hardy Wright | about 1 year ago
The Westboro Baptist Chruch, in no way espouses Baptist, or even Christian values; they are a hate group, nothing more, nothing less. It's all about publicity and personal gain for the "Rev." Fred Phelps, who has been involved in a number of shady actions.

Please don't take actions against anyone else based on the deluded and destructive actions of Phelps and his minions... they're seriously sick people.

Also remember that two wrongs don't make a right, even if three lefts do...

"It takes a cold hearted devil spawn to take away an innocent family's privacy to lay their loved one to rest."

Which is exactly what Phelps, his family and his supporters are... cold hearted devil spawn...
Reply By albertacowpoke Karl Gotthardt | about 1 year ago
Thank you for your comments and insight into this Wendy. I feel for those families, as I do for yours. These people are the scum of the earth and now they are even supported by SCOTUS. I wish your cousin Douglas J. Case a safe return.
Posted By MichelleDevlin MichelleDevlin | about 1 year ago
WendyCase I feel your anger that makes me sick - one thing I cannot stand is self-righteous hypocrites. Great report Karl thank you - very important issue!
Reply By albertacowpoke Karl Gotthardt | about 1 year ago
Michelle thank you for commenting. Very much appreciated
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