Mad as Hell Doctors Kick Off National Tour for Universal Health Care

This is going to be interesting. It is great to see this kind of movement by doctors and I hope they can make a difference. Thanks for this information and I hope you will write about their progress and keep us updated.

Thanks for expressing your interest, Delilah. I especially hope I'll be able to cover their Iowa visit. I admire them for their commitment to their convictions.

Interesting point of view these men have. It should be cool to see how far they get with this campaign

Their web presence impressed me. It will be interesting to follow up and watch the campaign progress. It's convenient that we can follow along online and don't have to depend on the mainstream media who may not give it much coverage. Thanks for your comment, Changez.

If I want to retain my current health care coverage, why should I be forced to change? If I'm not forced to change, why should I also be taxed to pay for somebody else's health care?

Why not reform that allows those with health care they want to keep it, and provides an safety net for those who need it? It doesn't have to be single-payer, nor should it be.

No government run program has ever operated on budget, on time, or on target; why should this one be any different?

firesisle, sounds like you think that those who are wealthy enough to afford coverage should be able to keep their coverage and also should not be taxed in order for those who are less fortunate to receive health care. But then I don't understand who will pay for the safety net you speak of in paragraph 2. I think I need more explanation or maybe a reference to more info explaining the various options. Basically, I'm understanding you to say that you're not opposed to every kind of health care reform, just not single-payer.

Your last paragraph sounds pretty sardonic on government programs. I can understand that feeling. But perhaps take care when using absolutes like "no government run program..." Government provides fire protection pretty effectively, for instance.

As always, firesisle, thanks for commenting. I frequently find what you say particularly thought-provoking.

Do you work for Twitter or Facebook? Or a paid blogger for this site?

http://www.allvoices.com/incentive

I think anyone who likes the coverage they have, should be able to keep it; end of story. My only problem with the current health care reform legislation, at least what I've seen, is the scope. To provide for a minority who don't have health care, they're ready to destroy the health care system that's working for the vast majority of US citizens. I don't think it has to be that way.

Taxing the rich sounds good, but never works; it always ends up impacting the people who can afford it the least, in the form of increased costs for goods and services.

There are many Americans, who started out at minimum wage and worked their way up to a middle class income level. Others, like me, reached that point, only to have the industry they worked in burn out in decline, and were forced to start over at minimum wage a second time, and work like a dog to get back to where they wanted to be.

Those of us in that position have paid our dues, some even several times over. We know what poor is because we've been there. A meal from a dumpster is still a meal, and playing music for tips still puts food in your belly. It's what drove us to work even harder so we wouldn't STAY there. When I was in school, they called it the "Puritan Ethic", that hard work would be rewarded, so we bought into it and it worked.

In many cases, we sacrificed things to pay for health care for our families, when some others, in the same wage bracket, chose to use the money for other things. They chose not to afford health care, for what ever reason. Why should anybody be forced to pay higher taxes to make up for another person's lack of foresight or personal responsibility?

Like many liberals and progressives, I believe health care should be a right. I think we share this belief with many conservatives and others. Those who truly can't afford health care have my unbridled compassion. Our primary point of difference is the way it should be implemented.

The current plans, as presented, seem to me to be like building a lion trap to catch a mouse. Personally, I hate to trust anything to the government, because I don't trust the government with anything.

I'd much rather see some kind of tax credit or even a guaranteed government rebate to subsidize those who are at the poverty level, for health care premiums to a private insurance company, with no exclusions for preexisting conditions, age or health status. That would have to go hand in hand with tort reform to lower the premiums for malpractice insurance, and outlawing some prescription drug practices, like relabeling at at profit, and putting an absolute ceiling on generic drugs.

It's not that I'm such a big fan of private insurance; I just think the government would make it much worse, not better, as they seem to do with everything they touch.

I hope that explains my position a little better...

Thanks, firesisle. It did. I really appreciate being able to discuss differences with you. I know I learn from it and that you challenge me to look at aspects of an issue in new ways.

Thank you for the report! We need more progressive activism in this country, it seems like the right-wing nutjobs are organized and spending a lot of money on keeping us in a third world status with health care. We have one of the worst health care systems in the modern world, health care is a right. Without a healthy population, how do they expect people to work for the slave wages the elite have worked so hard to bring about? It's about time the doctors stepped forward to let people know whats happening from and insiders perspective. Health insurance companies only prevent them from doing the job they are trained to perform, doctors are fed up too! People need to get out and attend these events to show their support for a single payer system.

No, the left wing loonies don't connect with the fact that there already exists in all 50 states in this country "single payer" health care for the indigent and uninsured, and those who have been denied coverage under state provided plans.

So, are you that clueless?

Just saw this now and I can't believe I missed the Mad as Hell Doctors kick off here in Portland this morning. This may be the road trip to end all road trips. Great story.

The stories of lot of other "regular" people like the MAHDs who are taking action all over the world can be found on Changents where the Change Agents tell their own stories and build teams of supporters! http://changents.com/

It's a distinct pleasure to meet you, Alex. Your Change Agents site is remarkable. I'm already spreading that link and getting a positive response. I hope other readers will take a look too. Welcome to Allvoices. Hope we see more of you here.

Yes, I believe Oregon already has a state provided "single payer" plan already in existence which the state citizens of Oregon fund and which is more locally then accountable.

Unless I am reading the information incorrectly, it would appear these doctors are already getting well paid for the uninsured and indigent in Oregon, and are nothing more than more left wing loonies looking for some air time or print time, apparently, in order to promote their probably outrageous fees and practices.

This is an odd story, once again, apparently from the liberal element. I also am confused as I believed Border Explorer (due, of course, to the name) either spent much time in a border state, or was also from the East Coast. Now we are from Iowa?

I have a great idea. For the money it will cost these doctors to traverse the country with this message for their own profits and benefits most of all (since doctors today are one of the highest paid professions whose hourly wages are now more than almost 1,000 times the minimum wage, where in the past generations actually were amongst most of the lowest paid in many rural communities especially), maybe these doctors could use their expensive mobile vehicle they are using for this road trip to conduct free health care screenings, especially during flu season - and treat all those illegals also that are in front of the Home Depots that use the emergency rooms for cases of the flu, that the American taxpayers are paying for.

That way, they can provide health care services, get paid by Uncle Sam, and charge less than the emergency rooms do and save the taxpayers in the process a great deal in those costs.

And then Obama and Geithner, as a part of the AIG bailout for that London based global insurer which also has health care plans, can mandate that part of that bailout includes covering the indigent and uninsured in this country for the next 10 years to pay back those bailout sums in increments back to the taxpayers then in the process.

Unbelievable, really, the magnitude this has taken. Since I'm sure that this doctor's state and state citizens already pay for his fees for those who are uninsured as a "single payer," and also still makes a fairly good amount on his Medicare patients.

Just goes to show the elitism also that exists in that profession, rather than the actual service industry it was meant to be.

And since this really is not a federal issue at all, but a state one, since it is not a Constitutional duty of the federal government, if you all want universal health care, then call on Congress to provide the Constitutional amendment that would afford them then the ability to institute such a law in the first place.

Because right now, they have no such authority. And many of your fellow citizens do not wish to subsidize either your insurance, or others, and many have religious beliefs that preclude much of the procedures for which they will then be forced to subsidize also impinging on their rights and freedoms.

Since the fascist left appears that all that don't agree with them, still need to kick in to the "communal" pot (and which actually is communism). So why not just idenify yourselves correctly at this point.

You aren't really left wing loonies at all, but communists actually, in your beliefs that everyone should communally contribute for health care for all in this country. That is the definition of pure communism.

Why aren't you directing your attention to your states if what is now being provided at that level isn't adequate, and call them on their extra Constitutional spending habits also, rather than providing for some of these basic public needs and duties? Rather than funding the next major strip mall?

In reply to Ross1776. You have got be one of the right-wing bullypit's paid minions, how many town meetings did you get bussed out to disrupt last month? Your hateful, self righteous comments have wall-papered this post to the point no one cares about your opinion. If you're not being paid, then it's really sad that you're spending so much time acting against your own best interests. Earlier you made the "fascist left" comment, showing your true colors. Your a typical rabid right winger accusing others of the very thing you hate about your self, you also need to get your "ism's" straight. Eight years of Bush and Republicans running the economy into a ditch was all about the road to fascism. I have no idea why you guys want to shrink government down to the size of being able to fit it in a bath tub so you can hand all your power over to banks, insurance companies and corporations that could care less about "you" since they only exist to profit off "you". When corporations run the government it's called fascism, hello? America has one of the worst health care systems and also has one of the lowest infant mortality rates in the industrialized world. We have a horrible record on all accounts. Citizens of socialized countries have great things to say about their system and they're generally happier and healthier than the average American. Every system has problems and nothings perfect, what we have is broken. Socialized medicine works and that's the last thing the insurance companies want you to know, because keeping you sick is profitable. Health care is a right for all, not a privilege. If you have a healthy population, you have a productive population which ultimately leads to prosperity and a healthy economy. It only makes sense that by providing universal equal access to health care, in the long run your going to have a wealthier nation and a happier society that won't overthrow your ass when the masses of left-wing loonies get fed-up with being taken advantage of and ignored by the elite who have you guys brainwashed - hey when and if the brainwashing wears off maybe you'll wake-up to join the rest of "humanity"! I'll take socialized medicine any day and would be all the healthier for it. You guys on the right have been listening to Limbaugh and the wackodoodles like Beck on the right-wing propaganda machines like FOX News too long. These guys are paid millions of dollars a year to keep you listening to their psychobabble, blatant lies designed to provoke anger, hate and fear inciting people towards division and violence. The whole divide and conquer ploy works like a charm with the ill-informed. This is a time when we all need to be working together towards the same cause, instead we're at each others throats. I don't believe the word corporation exists anywhere in the constitution, the forefathers were concerned about the welfare and happiness of individuals, not the profits of insurance companies or corporations. So why are you guys surrendering all of your power and our rights over to these entities that only exist to profit from us? Our politicians have all sold themselves out for millions of dollars on the health care issue, they don't give a damn about you...now that's fascism and eight years of Bush-Cheney Co was all about selling out. I've even heard Bush talk about being a dictator as if it were wishful thinking, so get off the fascism stuff as if its a left-wing creation. At least get your terms straight and stop projecting the things you hate about yourself upon others. On a moral and spiritual level, we are all our brothers keepers. Our purpose in life is to learn to be in service to others - not an island to ourselves, totally disconnected from people by our technological gadgets and devices.

Many of my ideals and values and opinions are similar to yours, muzikdiva. Thanks for commenting here.

And I hate to remind you also, but Bush had a Democratic Congress his last two years in office. And Obama has run this country into a far deeper ditch, and in that bank bailout, all the did was transfer monies from the Federal Reserve to the their "branches" so that they could negotiate with those foreign investors, and then foreclose on the homes of those American citizens anyway and get a great deal in the bargain in order to flip them for the illegals they plan to next sucker into those very same loans who won't speak any English.

And you appear to be a blind liberal, since you have your "ism" incorrect also. I am not "right wing" nor "left wing" since either "wing" is liberal insofar as Constitutional construction is concerned. And under our Constitution, if there is no "consent of the governed" or vote for an amendment to afford the federal government to inflict this added taxation on the American people, it is not within their power to do without a formal amendment - and due to the 9th Amendment itself, that takes a full vote of the people.

Since the Constitution does have an amendment process in there provided so that it is the "people's" will, and not simply the liberal elements will, that determines whether or not additional "property" in the form of taxes such as this one can be levied on the Americans.

The government works for all Americans, not simply you or your agendas, and it takes the people in general at their consent, not simply public pressure from special interest groups, to remove the "freedom" of the American people's insofar as their own health care needs to be overriden by a federal mandate such as this one.

And every state in this union already has a single payer plan for those indigent, and also county hospitals that are free if you cannot pay for surgical treatments.

And this is simply another attempt to centralize more power in Washington, rather than at the state level, and against our entire form of Constitutional Republicanism.

So why not talk to Schwartenegger, as I said, and tell him to pass on the next strip mall, or addition to Disneyland, and increase the provisions instead and funding for California's own single payer plan that already exists.

And if you've read any of my articles, I belong to neither political party and take Constitutional stances on issues. Since both parties have merged at this point.

And Obama is another liberal, just as Bush was in Constitutional construction.

But it appears you haven't read it either.

Diversion is a great liberal tactic. But you haven't answered a single one of the questions.

And if any here are paid bloggers, it certainly isn't me but the liberals that come out in force anytime anyone challegens their lunacy and misrepresentations.

Which is what most of this is on the site by those paid bloggers. Misrepresentations. And lies.

Muzikdiva, you make some excellent points.

Unfortunately, there are some people who come on these kinds of comment threads just to use them as a platform for their own twisted, illogical, name-calling, delusional rants.

It's sad, really, to observe someone so bitter, and full of cynical rhetoric that all logic and reasoning is beyond their ability to conceptualize rational thought.

Many contributors have learned to ignore this person, because there is absolutely no way to have a rational dialog--but you are to admired for trying.

"Unfortunately, there are some people who come on these kinds of comment threads just to use them as a platform for their own twisted, illogical, name-calling, delusional rants."

Yep... unfortunate. In the end, however, that's what it's all about. All sides, all perspectives, all spins; passionate people will have passionate disagreements.

It would be nice to see a little less ad hominum on both sides. It's illogical and adds nothing to the issue at hand. I think everybody is guilty of it at some time(with the possible exception of BorderExplorer; never really seen her go off on anybody).

Contributors from both sides have something to offer, which the readers can take or leave, as they choose. Any of us can agree, disagree, or agree to disagree, but just as blind squirrels occasionally pick up acorns, people on different sides of the political arena occasionally offer things of value and interest to the group in general.

Neither Liberals, nor Conservatives hold their particular views because they're stupid, illogical, twisted, or delusional. They're merely reflecting a particular paradigm which they use to filter every issue. As long as they stick to those issues(a little light-hearted ribbing aside), without denigrating or ridiculing the person instead, things will move forward.

When it becomes personal, either as an attack or a response, all intellectual value is gone. Might as well just move out the furniture, lock the door and fight till somebody dies...

Agreed: if contributors from both sides can tone down the rhetoric we'll product more light and less heat. This comment is good advice and a great even-handed observation on your part in my estimation, firesisle. Thank you for stating it.

I'm here to share ideas. Not to win. Not to recruit. Not to sell. Let's all take a deep breath. Peace!

Exactly... winning is way overrated...*big smile*

Thanks, Delilah. You're a very skillful communicator! I hope you know how much I appreciate you.

I hate to point out the obvious, but those that believe in global warming with respect to the Cap & Trade tax and the basis for it, do seem to be the illogical ones, and also bitter and cynical in their views since it appears you haven't a clue at all at just how victimized some of your fellow Americans who have lost their homes in the hundreds of thousands have been "progressively" due to the "progressives" agendas, that do seem to care for the animals and trees much more than they do for their fellow Americans in any manner whatsoever.

And that Cap & Trade Bill was a Wall Street feeder, and anyone who has studied it in any depth would know this as a fact, and not bitterness or cynical at all. If you trust those in Washington, ma'am, at this point you really are the one who is beyond reason.

Since it is clearly scientifically proven that the reason for climatic changes which have occurred minimally are actually due to the heating of the Earth's core most of all.

And the fact is, I do have a scientific background also due to the fact that my father's degrees were in both Chemistry, and Wood Technology from Penn State University and worked with the loggers and timber industry all his life.

So start using facts and actually experience and knowledge so that your articles don't come off as the propaganda pieces they are, since it is clear that anyone with a background or who has actually researched the matter, would know that your propaganda is looney liberalism at its finest.

And as one who lived in a border state for over 45 years, believe my expertise with this issue is unquestionable, rather than one who has, it appears, merely been a tourist on occasion and "visited."

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Wow, I have so enjoyed reading everyone's comments about this subject. It is great to see how Americans are so ready to comment so strongly on things that affect their lives.
Here in South Africa we tend to have an over supper moan about what is happening and then sit down and moan about what is on the television. Hate to admit it but South Africans tend to sit on riempie stools (low stools with the seating made from strips of hide) on their stoops (verandahs) and watch the world go by, getting annoyed when someone suggests they should get up and do something themselves.

Thanks for that complement, brgidprimrose. I'd venture to say, however, that Allvoices contributors are probably a cut above the American norm in terms of involvement and acumen for current events.

It is good to see that there are still groups campaigning for the single payer solution. I doubt that you will see much of them on Fox News or even CNN. Virtually all advanced capitalist countries have a single payer or at least universal coverage system in which health care is regarded as a right. Only the US is the exception and although it has the most expensive system it still fails to cover everyone.
Obama only talked once about the single payer system as a position on the left and mentioned the Canadian system. He did not take the opportunity to correct the many misrepresentations of the system by current ads on main U.S. TV stations. Obama's reform will turn out to be a big plus for insurance companies as it will in effect force everyone to buy insurance and the government will play the role of subsidizing premiums. The two party system in the U.S. has to go since both main parties are simply plumping for powerful interests.
The right is certainly correct that there is going to be a problem with funding what Obama recommends. Seniors are right to worry about their medicare entitlements. Although there is a great deal of waste in the system some of that waste is profitable to vested interests and will be difficult to eliminate, more difficult than cutting back services perhaps in the name of reducing the deficit.

HOO-ray for northsum32! How nice to read someone else advocating for a multi-party system. One, this swinging back and forth between one set of special interests and the other would be squeezed to the minimum with several parties vying for power. Two, PACs and national pundits and news media moguls would have a much tougher time of monopolizing an undue portion of the political parties when there are six or more to deal with.

The best change that could come from Mr. Obama's time in office is for the Republican party to split into a number of smaller parties, and the Democrats following close behind.